Advisory for affiliates & startups with Lou Viveros

a lot of people end up with an agent or a broker whose sole interest is selling your business and the primary interest is not necessarily you getting the right deal the best value it's you selling your business right an advisor's role is always look out for you your interests and I always come back to value is the value there is the value fair is it a good deal is it not a good deal how to we make it better and then finding a path through the

woods is the advisor's role get once you get through the woods it's the broker's job to get the deal done arriving at the right deal is the advisor job so an important distinction I'm John Wright and you're listening to affiliate bi the business intelligence and affiliate marketing podcast brought to you by stat welcome to the phbi podcast today we're chatting with L pero who is the founder of Market Solutions LLC which is a management consulting firm based in California Silicon Valley where he spent most of

his 40-year uh business career he's been involved in the SEO industry as an adviser to a number of businesses including some m&a works and he's also the founder of SBO coach which is simply put helping small business owners conquer the challenges they face at each stage of their business journey I think the world needs more coaches so Lou welcome to the show thanks John thanks for having me and so I want to get started looking at your work history like I know you from only probably

the second half which is the involvement in the SEO space but looking at your background it seems that you had an early start into Tech and the world of games as in like video games and I think there's some m&a stories along the way so I just want to ask how you got started in that area yeah you said the my second half it's probably my 10th it's really only uh the last few years that I've got sucked into the Vortex of SEO and we can

wind the path to how we got there but basically yeah I started in video games uh I've been in the Silicon Valley since the early 1980s 80s and 90s were very video game Heavy worked at Activision during the early Nintendo and Sega days entrepreneurial bug hit me and ended up wandering out on my own started a pretty successful uh video game marketing agency clients like Electronic Arts and Sega and Sony and and many others so that all went well and I took it a step further

and ended up starting a couple of video G Studio where we actually published a lot of product and did that through 80s and 90s but all that his experience essentially led to the creation of Market Solutions in in in 1999 and that's what I've been doing since for this entire Millennia Millennium and in that it's been really surveying big companies big businesses opened up a lot of channels for Logitech worked with some Regional launches for Blackberry otbx a lot of global brands that really did pretty

well with then I'm going to say it's about four or five years ago now Matt Diggity who I think everyone in the SEO industry is familiar with was in the involved in a an m& deal his attorney who I know from other activity s to hand you really need some guidance on this because I give you legal advice but that's there's a lot of things that are going to be business decisions and lawyers for all their good on the legal side business decisions are something that

they rarely like to get involved it I connected with digity had never heard of him I knew very little about SEO I was totally naive as to what was going on behind my Google search and it was like pulling back the on The Wizard of was look what's going on beyond the either Google search so I really opened my eyes Dy and I really HED off connected very well and I've been involved with him ever since the that particular deal that we came together on and

did very well for him and for his partners and success that breeds confidence I've been a part of dignity world ever since and then you start connecting dots from ding to everybody else and have now been involved in a lot of SEO projects still without knowing a whole lot about SEO but really knowing business and uh the the way we like to say it is business intelligence is readily available you could research you could find out you can get informed on business intelligence business wisdom only

comes with experience and 40 Years of doing this there's a lot of experience there that little nuggets that can surface that are very valuable to people who who haven't been through that before so really it's been dispensing business wisdom to a lot of good people in SEO and it's an industry I really come to admire and and enjoy yeah I think you said something which I I know I can relate to lawyers typically don't do like your standard advisory you ask them to do contracts and

all that stuff they'll do that but it's very rare they'll step in and go hey do you think this is a good idea and I have one small experience where I was going through a turn shoot and the lawyer was like you do realize what this term sheet is about right so it's it's not often that you have people looking out on your side and just in my limited experience of dealing with some people in the m&a space it's a whole different ball game and it

sounds like not enough people get these advisers to guide them through the the wh ifs or how to make sure you either don't get screwed or more rather how to get the best value out of that yeah and and there's an important point there that a lot of people end up with an agent or a broker who sole interest and there's a lot of really good ones out there it's a very specific field with great people but the primary interest is selling your business and the

primary interest is not necessarily you getting the right deal the best value is you selling your business right and advisor's role is much different and in fact you not to develop proprietary information but my first job with mity was to tell him kill that deal that you're trying to do because here's a b and c of why you shouldn't do it and in hindsight very risky our relationship would have been very different if we killed that deal and there was nothing else that materialized right hind

side I was right and it worked out well so an advisor's role is always look out for you your interests and I always come back to value is the value there is the value fair is it a good deal is it not a good deal how can we make it better and then finding a path through the woods is the advisor's Ro get once you get through the woods it's the broker's job to get the deal done arriving at the right deal is the advisor job

so an important distinction I think it touched upon something that maybe I'm realizing from my own experience it's I don't think it's difficult to find a really good SEO like you look at the people that you think about when it comes to SEO there's the fury kazon Matt digity Kyle Ruth they're easy to find because they put themselves up there and then they share all this content but I don't really think that there's a ton of content on the advisory side it's like this mysterious Market

that you can't touch or seat and I'm just wondering if this is why people run into these situations where it's like look at my situation last couple years I did have people say hey they wanted to be our adviser but we waited and we had all sorts of offers like people that I felt wanted way too much equity and then it's we don't know which direction we're going in and maybe it's maybe this is like a new Marketplace out here yeah the SEO some of the

names you named are clients of mine the reality is that there are a lot of part of what is really inspired me and drawn me to the SEO industry is the entrepreneurial spirits spirits of every agency every owner every businesses there there is youth energy VOR all built around I I own my own business I'm captain of my own ship and it's all on me there's a whole different world out there that is the corporate 9 to5 I've got good benefits I've got a stable paycheck

and it's just a different mindset so the energy of that small business is everywhere in SEO and as you look around most Industries there are a few TS billion dooll companies most multi-billion dollar companies if you're on you're on you're on SEO what are the biggest companies 10 million 15 million $20 million there's $20 million is a bake company in SEO right right so is is very exciting to have so many different people different people involved in their own ownership interest of those businesses that I

think there's a real opportunity for helping out the CH is that all of those businesses not all of them but many of them bootstrapping try to make it work month in and month out it's hard to be able to come up with the money every month to get into an advisory structure then the alternative is giving up equity which by advice everybody everybody s is hold on to equity as long as you possibly can unless you're getting more value than what that Equity is currently orally

worth it's a double-edge sword you give up Equity you're potentially giving up a lot more money you don't have the monthin month out cash flow to bring in the right advisor it's a challenge and it's not like it's an SEO campaign that you can try and if it fails you just like move on when you're dealing with Equity you make a mistake I believe that sometimes the wrong mistakes will actually syn a company yeah when you it's not uncommon to do desperate things desperate time and

it can Cloud your judgment and suddenly you find yourself with the wrong partner and there's nothing that'll sink a more than a bad partnership that that positive energy is gone everybody's dreading the Enterprise and it's just hard to make anything work in that kind of structure so yeah the one of the the V feeling in one of digity businesses the affiliate land and guest host on one of his that's actually launching I think next week all about joint ventures and picking the right partner so there's

like a quarter of the time is spent talking about the right structure the right partner you need to find the right Partners you need to find the right structure and and if you misstep on that it could potentially go to the train completely off the tracks I agree with you yeah and again like I I wish I seen this content 10 years ago when getting started Ed with actually setting up Partnerships so it's not a lot of content on there like you can technically find it

but I mean whatever you're going to find in YouTube I think you're just going to find a whole bunch of a couple good things but in a pile of a hot mess and it's good luck trying to sift through the really good content yeah yeah and a lot of it and so as I look around I see a bajillion life coaches Eric life coaches there are even more um big Business Consultants who can help you reorganize and re-energize your thousand person company the and the resources

resources for small business coaches small business owners so SVO small business owner is an area that I believe is underserved um the stuff that's out there get an ebook on being a small business owner great here's more AI content thrown at you at $29 9 cents and a you know open up a fortune CI you're going to have better luck right so we are and spend a lot of time and energy trying to really get very good human developed content courses classes that are geared to

small B holders cuz I've been there you know from everywhere from one man startup where I'm the janitor and the receptionist and the CEO all at the same time till it's experience where I was the worldwide division general manager for $70 billion panon from one to tens of thousands I've lived it and I said earlier that you more than business intelligence and business wisdom and that's what I'm really looking to help bring in a cost-effective manner because we talked earlier about the barrier to having that

kind of advice and support is cost but try to do it in a more cost- effective manner that can reach a much broader audience is the idea behind this new project it's interesting you said there's H tens of thousands if not probably millions of life coaches I think they're everywhere and they exist all on Instagram and all that I used to do affiliate coaching and I actually enjoyed the work but maybe it was my own way of not executing it properly in terms of I had

one Business Partnership that worked out but then I had a couple in the corner where these people were just taking advantage of my time and it's it wasn't like you you paid to get access it it was meant to be like a sub affiliate commission if they made money I made money but I actually I'm starting to think with the work you're doing maybe there still is a market for affiliate coaching and I mean to be very honest if I just looked at Matt Di's Playbook

from day one I probably should have just copied that and said hey here's something that is clearly working well yeah hey the model is great the challenge is execution you go to his YouTube channel and it's just end to end lots of stuff that is not going to happen overnight and so you reach a point where there it's a scale to it that you know how do you compete but all saying how do you eat an elephant the only answer is one bite at a time

right so you can't say oh man I don't have a thousand videos on my YouTube channel take a bite chew swallow now you only need not every mind not so that that day by day step by step is important to to keep in mind that's definitely one thing that I made mistakes early on in my Philly Journey it's I wanted to do everything and then I got impatient and yeah like with people like Matt that's clearly one signature of success they have is compounding stuff over

time I think what maybe it's me maybe it's a lot of other people but I think everyone in affiliate marketing when they're sold on the idea they get excited about getting into the space right they they want the million with the minimal effort and effort is is key there because we're we're talking a lot about mat digity but it's worth talking about because it's a model for a lot of people out there to see what he's done I met few people that work as hard as

EG who are in position to not really had to work that hard anymore but still worked harder than he did when he began I think my calendar is full I looked at his calendar and it's and what the hell are you doing but that effort that that drive is either ingrained or it's and if it's been and you have dreams and aspirations of XY andz if you're not prepared to put in the efforts reset your your your expectations it's okay it's okay to know not achieve

what other people are achieving and have a different work life balance live a different lifestyle enjoy canoeing more than other people I out of thin air there there's no judgment on what makes a good life for you but don't set yourself up to fail based on expectations that are unrealistic you know yourself better than anyone else does right so you've got to set your expectations relative to your skills um your willingness to learn and your effort and desire those are it's not rocket science and I

would still attribute like guys like Matt and a few other people I'm pretty sure they love what they do if they did I think they would they definitely jump ship and find something else e no dep and I said earlier as part of what is I found so appealing about the SEO industry is everyone loves it they they love what they're doing they would a lot of these guys would shove a pen in their eye if they had to work a N9 to-5 in a big

corporate cubicle form that that part of the energy is what I really enjoy about SCM staying on topic with SEO but pivoting a little bit one thing in the SEO space that I don't see a lot of is Sweat Equity like people saying hey rather than taking money for SEO Consulting it's can I take a cut of your business and I've seen it on both sides of the fence I've seen it where seos will do work and they get frustrated with clients that don't do what

they're supposed to do because it's going it's a two-way street but what's your thought on this as a business model do you think there's going to be more of this kind of investing in companies as a means of saying we're investing by giving you SEO yeah yeah so specific and again I'm referring to the the video that's coming out next week on what of Max courses uh um developed a program called a convertible recoupable shared interest model where it's set up to allow agencies to offer

their traditional agency services services and at some point convert some of the fees and bonuses that are built into it into equity in their client business so the conent is you're not changing anything you're doing but it's a creative way to allow Partnerships to Blossom without a lot of risk if the relationship's gone well everyone's happy everyone sees a bright future you have an opportunity to convert some of the money that's been paid by your client into Equity your client gets a a rebate on money

they've paid and has a new partner and now the agency has a vested interest in making sure that client's business does really well so it ends up as win for everybody without this idea of give me Equity and'll give you service that's going to be a hard one to really get done on day one of any relationship you need to develop the relationship it's got to be trust it's got to be respect it's got to be mutual understanding of value from both sides and I think

that Equity is a great way to grow your portfolio of business interests the business owner that has an SEO agency getting a little bite of a lot of different pies is as good as starting a whole new pie byel it seems like the Digger the further I dig into some of these SEO agencies where I know they invest in companies are you seeing more established agencies going hey we want to get into this new layer of business where like the game could be like really lucrative

you know the m&a piece of it you so with most of my clients on the advisory side phase one is always Clarity of Clarity of Clarity of purpose what is it that you want at the end of the day when the end credits roll on the movie what do you want that ending start there and I always refer to it as your car GPS yes it doesn't say how many left turns do you want to make it says where do you want to go right but

you got to start with the destination before you can figure out how I day get so the m& side there's a lot of people who are very uh anxious to build it to a certain level that take that and go to something else right but if that's your path that's your desired path you've got to know know that you've got to build to that and you have to intentionally work your business to that goal there's other people that don't feel the need to cash something out

they love what they're doing they love their Partners they love their clients they love their industry and just want to nurture it grow it the difference between an apple orer that is built for commercial purpose to strip it every year and sell it versus hey this is for my family it's my friends I lot of caner I lot of me PA it's it's just a different mindset so that Clarity of purpose is vital at the beginning of it and then if there's a role at some

point to bring in Partners bring in other equ so again this is the clarity of purpose I want to be a $10 million business okay why $10 million because X Y and Z these guys have done it and I think I can do what they've done or my grandfather built a $10 million business by the time he was 50 and I wanted to do it by the time I'm 40 I and I'm just pull the examples out of the year but this is the kind of

St in people's evence and so being clear on what it is that you're trying to do is vital to figuring out how to do it some people want to build a business up to a certain level and then they realize that it's never going to grow Beyond this Plateau without some infusion of capital and if you want to be a $10 million business in your Plateau to 2 million and you're not going to get be on to without a big Capital Capital Capital infusion you got

to put some kind of equity auction on the thing right and that means hey I'm going to go how let that capitalize it I can go borrow money I can do fan workk with friends I can find a potential Inquisitor that wants to sing to the next level or do you get an equity investment and give out X percentage equity in my business it all is there but it's coming back to what is it you want to do and what is it you want to where

what your destination I don't know I wanted around there but hopefully that made sense now there there's definitely a lot to unpack there I'm really interested now in that that course you put in for the affiliate lab so might have to join just for that I'll make sure I down the any a commission yeah we'll find a way to put a link in there so on the last question when I was talking about Sweat Equity for SEO I want to take this concept and shift it

over to the Philly Network space so your typical Philly network works like this like they organize a bunch of brands or products and services they do it at scale and you as the affiliate or the publisher you have one affiliate manager you have you get paid from one company rather than having to deal with 400 different uh affiliate programs and typically they can give you a better deal like it depends on the the niche in affiliate marketing but do you think there's an opportunity for the

affiliate Network side to be involved in maybe some sort of Sweat Equity or something because in theory if you're the affiliate Network and your Affiliates are making more money you're technically incentivized to help them grow if you're affiliate network if your Publishers start to sync in Revenue you're sinking in Revenue you're actually at risk of going at a business so I don't think I've seen this concept before but I want to get your take on it yeah I guess that my my initial take is that

if you are doing a philh marketing you have Sweat Equity because your work is converted into commissions and there is no great SP equ of the commission something sells you get a piece of it that is not traditionally thinking of it as equity in terms of ownership being an entity there's a lot of deals that that we do that don't involve any kind of share or interest in the entity itself but are more driven to profit share Revenue share some kind of cut some kind of

growth incentives to be Equity at the end of the day unless it's a business that's going to be sold right at some point in time Equity just means you're getting a share of proceeds of the businesss and if you're interested in having a piece of something that is eventually going to be part of a of an m&a or liquidity event then yeah equity's important if this is just going to be an ongoing business if you're an affiliate marketing you have equity in the business are because

you get a piece of every set so the question would be how can you add value to your role to increase the percentage you get because like I said you you've already got Equity so how do you have more Equity I think is the question versus how do you get shares in a business it's how do I increase my revenue or profit share on the business their not because I I look at this from a different point of view like an idea I had many years

ago so when I was doing Sweat Equity for an affiliate site my responsibility there was to do their SEO and their design so I did that for almost 10 years and it worked out pretty well and it just gave me that full circle idea about going to Cas Sweat Equity for SEO but when I think about it with from a network point ofie I just think that no one's really crossed that boundary and it's exactly what you just said it's still Revenue share it's it's like

a form of equity without the actual complicated contract now if you want to throw a really messy intellectual property or ownership contract in the mix you can but it's not necessary but I just think this is a prime opportunity to say if I'm an affiliate Network and I've got let's say a th Publishers and they're generating let's say five million per month like I'm technically would be incentified to actually hire an SEO team and say how can we help all these people who can we actually

optimize I just think there's a bigger opportunity to take an agency concept and go let's plug it into here you can trade it it it goes back to the contract you were talking about right going to there's always getting a little more organizational Theory now in supply chain Theory but um you know the value outed chain is upstream and downstream right you've got vendors you've got custom right and there's always ways to expand your interest upstream or Downstream if it's through this this program I was

talking about earlier about the convertible recoupable program that is from your customers right and trading your service into some form of equity in your customer down street there's also Upstream hey if I do X Y and Z you know you can I get some equity in your total business because I may not be your only agency that is reselling or representing you may have other projects going on on that would be a good way for me to diversify my business so if I give you 5%

instead of 4% I don't know making numbers up can you then Trade Me Out sub Revenue share on your total business that it's a math exercise what do 1% of the business I'm doing with you mean as a percent of my total business and there you got some Equitable measure of what's that trade-off Worth right and then you want have the agency with their vedors having some level of interest in making sure that they can expand their total business and not just what they're doing here

right so the best place to go when you are looking at any kind of partnership or Equity is within your existing value attit your customers want you to succeed and do better because then they have better stuff your vendors want you to succeed because then they have a better sales chain right looking within your own ecosystem is a good place to start before you start venturing off into someone who doesn't know anything about what you do or someone who's just looking at Raw numbers is he

going to have a full picture yeah I think I'm connecting the dot so going back to that hypothetical situation if I owned an affiliate Network in theory I would have been working with my Affiliates or Publishers potentially for years so I would know them very well and if I someone who's networked within the SEO space and I can trust companies like Authority Builders or like just the search intell all these different agencies it's like you're bringing the best of both world because those two people on

either side might not know each other but that would be my advantage by having the connections and going I know these people are actually going to deliver what they say they will right yeah it's we talked earlier about you've got to have that trust you've got to have that history and trusted him another Topic in head video of incoming is trust and usually that's one where history and experience is really what builds that it doesn't happen overnight yeah it takes time I I'm doing it through

this podcast so that's one of my go to markets for trust if that's a thing yeah they we need to know you yeah it helps all right so before we started recording we were talking about uh the SBO so it's small business owner owner and your background at the very beginning is you're coming from like the corporate world billions of dollars of transactions so how would you say this translates like your experience to be able to pass out on to this it doesn't matter if it's

affiliate or SEO like we're small people on this side what are some of the things that you you're able to pass on as saying hey I've got all this knowledge in experience this is how you translate this for Success yeah so the interlaced with my big corporate experience and it's funny the way it worked out there was it was like a sandwich there was always a layer of entrepreneurial meet between e Vice support support support and so I have been starting and running businesses since I

was in my early 20s uh and now in my early 60s so 40 Years of of um you know business experience on has earlier from very small to the biggest to big and the ones that were the most gratifying and fulfilling were the small right and then in the past four years five years the work I've been doing in SEO has really grounded me back into that small all business owner mentality so the SBO as we're calling them all have a their own individual business journey

is unique no one has the same business journey and every spbo is has their own path to walk but there are are are Universal type of guidance that can help everyone so really the way we built out the the program is focus by stage right so it's going to be I'm thinking about starting a new business and here in the US done this election coming up where One of the the promises made by one of the candidates is we're going to incentivize new business right so

if you start a new business and so if that plays out there's going to be a lot of people looking to start a new business who have been in the corporate world their whole life or have never started a business that need to know the ABCs or what the hell do I need to do to start business so phase one as always I'm thinking about starting a business that is I recently started a business and now I'm trying to figure it all out to my I've

got a good business it's growing success is never fine and growth Brews when it its own set of problems so that there's a SC of issues at that stage of your business there's a stage of hey I've been doing this a long time our business is really successful I'm ready for transition and that could be I want to get out I want to go by my competitor so that I can double my business I want to diversify into under markets so that transition phase is the

next one there and then the Final Chapter we've got that's available there is times of Crisis I've got a lot of troubles I've got a lot of issues I got a lot of problems in each of those five situations there's a different set of stuff that you need to right and so we're trying to make it as simple and digestible as possible to really get focused on your particular stage there's not one universal hey you out of business you're all the same you everybody's different and

you're in one of those stages of your Evolution so here's some core components that help you out and then beyond that if we need to do some course work we've got courses again suited to each of those stages so it's we've set it up as the traditional College coursework goes 10121 301 401 right so we've got bis lab 101 which is just an eight all of the bis lab series is free so we want to encourage and help people in a very friendly and accepting manner

right everybody's got people are afraid to ask these typle questions for seeming like they don't know they really don't know what's going on Happ order business if you don't know that's not our response to there's no dumb questions so we set up this Biz lad series 101 2011 301 401 and 911 which is for those emergency situations that each cater to those particular stages of of the evolution those are all free online classes that we do in a group set if you need to dive in

more then is coursework which is again group coursework it's a sixe course and we're going to in a group go through a lot of details and then there's a lot of offline work that's got to be done and then at another stage if you need individual cing then that's a different project but that's available as well to focus on you individually specific so that's how we've got the pyramid set up from hey I just want some free general advice on my situation in this particular State

and we find that here appear networking and communication proves great support and release right someone asked question some what else in there says I was thinking that too re I'm not alone and I'm not alone is part of the underlying Dean Dean Dean here and it's very easy as an SBO to get into a into a solitary I've got the responsibility of the world on my shoulders I've got six employees all of their families rely on my business none of them really know the financial situation

none of them know I got my house on the line it's a lonely place place place and so when you just toose that sensation of loneliness with the fact that 9.9% of all the businesses in the US are small businesses you are part of the majority super majority super majority and so being able to feel that experience that Network thatat and feel that peer-to-peer connection and know that you're not alone is probably the most enjoy enjoyable part for me is to see that sense of relief

that I'm not alone I'm not in this alone and so that is kind of what we're try to do the free class we really built to obviously as a funnel going learn to do more work with you but as purose to know I've had a very good career and and thankful for what I have and if there is an hour of my time a week that can go to helping other people much younger not quite there on their path find a path through the woods then

that is that's well worth it yeah I agree like I know in the Journey of what I had to do in helping startup uh the startup it was there's technically a lot of content but it's that the communities they're all just in different directions there's too many voices and I think it's it's very difficult to get like anyone's one-on-one time and even if you do it's the the voices you get come in every single direction oh you need to do more sales or sales Le growth

and then you've got the product Le growth people over here and then you've got got marketing and SEO and yeah can't please everyone but it's I think people suffer from analysis paralysis and not having a imunity yeah and the the other factor that you see is the idea that an SBO needs to at least to his employees to his cerous everybody really appear to be the authority the one who knows what's going on the one that knows where we're going the one that has total control

at that confidence that you need to inspire your customers vendor why is leades down a path know at all right and you have to give the aura of know it all but you can buy your own press clippings that you know it all if you know if you think you know it all you're on the dead end street because you can't learn you can't grow you can't take advice you can't correct yourself and those are all things that are vital to the getting your business to

the next level I agree what you said like a short while ago was like even like asking the DB questions and I think what a lot of business owners get is they're worried about asking the dumb question or feeling stupid or not know what they're doing and I basically tell everyone I'm like this is what I love about this podcast I could ask the dumb questions go I don't know this and it's it's one way for me to learn and it's one of the best ways

yeah that there is nothing wrong with the phrase I don't know and you'd be amazed how many people just can't say that I yeah I said at the outset of this that I'm somehow in the middle of all these SEO uh movers and shakers don't very little about SEO so it's but openly said I have no idea what you guys were just talking about but here's my thoughts on the business inac and knowing what knowing what you don't know and the stuff you don't know trying

to gather some knowledge on how you can learn it we at least know that by hanging with some seos enough I've at least SE behind the curtain yeah and then to wrap it up but what do you see of the future of affiliate marketing as it intersects with business intelligence yeah so I again here I have to rely on the SEO experts that happen to to hang out with and I think that that affiliate marketing as I've heard is on as we've knowned historically is on

a receding p and so everyone needs to reconfigure uh their business and a lot of is Du to Google I think we all understand and AI has something to do with that now where every search in Google is starts with the automated AI option and then there's now more sponsored links that are there as responses so you're now down to the bottom of that first page even if you got everything right a lot of movement especially in younger generations to social media and not so much

web search videos YouTube or if you're not figuring out how to make the video on YouTube side of your business work it's going to be a steep hill Decline and if there's a way to figure out how to bring SAS into your equation that has a very long Runway still of uh opportunity and the beauty of sass is it the register R when these Fleet and those are business models that everybody should aspire to don't know if that's helpful and not a lot of detail but

I think that's delay of the land that I'm here honestly I think more about SEO than a lot of Affiliates I've talked to I'm just going to take the last clip of what you said cuz everything from social to how people are searching to productizing I've been saying this for a little while but I'm only saying it because I get to like I said ask the dumb questions to the SEO experts more people need to hear that yeah good I wouldn't like myself an SEO expert

but I'm what the TV or the commercial I'm not a doctor but I play one on TV exactly not an SEO for around yeah you're an SEO in my book Lou thanks so much for doing this I want to pass it back to you how people can get a hold of you and of course we'll mention the affiliate lab course yeah so the affiliate lab for is part of a m Dig's business ecosystem that one is a subscription based I've got a I'm guest hosting a

course on joint ventures and Partnerships I think that breaks next week you can get a all of me uh under the new SBO coach Venture which is coach sboc coach.com the website is is undergoing some final here so that should be up and running here in the next couple weeks and that's sboc coach.com and then would love to hear from anyone that is interested in how we can help on their business Journey awesome thank you so much for doing this thanks thanks John thank you for

tuning in to the affiliate bi podcast I'd like to take this time to ask for a small favor to leave a raing and review wherever you listen to your podcast that helps us expand our reach to rank high in podcast directories and reach more listeners