Understanding retention & player value data with Adam Rowley

I think you know going back to kind of businesses I've worked with you know we've had affiliate managers where they have no responsibility at all apart from customers coming through the door if those players are poor or those customers are continuing to play that's the CRM team's fault the in in their that's all they do but they have worked with businesses where the affiliate manager it's their responsibility for the ROI so they need to have that I think data analyst I think for me if I

was to to start a marketing business today and and and build a brand out then a data analyst would be probably one of my first hes alongside an affiliate manager because that that is where you remove a lot of the risk in in over spending and overpaying for for customers I'm John R and you're listening to affiliate bi the business intelligence and affiliate marketing podcast brought to you by stab Welcome to the affiliate bi podcast today we're chatting with Adam roelly who is the managing director

at Raven TR and I'm excited to talk to Adam because he's managing an Enterprise affiliate platform and to be very blind these are the types of conversations that I love to have on this podcast and one of the reasons why we created it so I want to say Adam welcome to the show thanks Joe thanks for having us appreciate you you get up early to uh to do these podcast no worries always do it so first question right off the bat I want to basically pass

it to you to ask what does Raven track do I know the answer I don't think a lot of people do and why should operators reach out to you for your affiliate program software yeah so Raven track we are an igaming affiliate Trucking platform um we have been sculpted and created for I gaming but we also are available to on board clients across multile across multile Industries uh we've been going now since around 2018 on the platform was built around um kind of industry experts and

you know different areas of the industry and how we wanted to work um back in 2018 uh we decided to focus solely on on I gaming and not look at other Industries at the time and fast forward six years now we have 155 clients and we drive around a billion clicks per month um so yeah that that's where we are at the moment and uh why should people use us I guess that's the the big question um so without turning into a salesperson uh I'd like

to think we know what we're doing um as I've just mentioned you know we were built by experts in each field so whether that was affiliate managers whether that was compliance team Finance media buys content creation you know everybody in the business has done that previously in existing roles so I've run a lot of affiliate marketing companies I've run Brands I've been in the affiliate I've been an affiliate manager so I know what was available to us throughout that period and what wasn't and we tried

to create something that makes a lot of people's jobs a lot easier so easier so taking bits from from competitors and tracking platforms that I've used for the last 12 years that have worked fantastically well some things that maybe haven't worked so well and started to kind of build and develop on that so yeah I think using that that experience of being on both sides of the coin has kind of really helped us to to kind of build our Raven track and and kind of continue

on the trajectory that we're going at the moment yeah I I It's actually an interesting topic I think a lot of people in our space don't always have experience being on both sides of the fence as an affiliate manager or on the operator side and for me personally I think uh when people cross over they they take their experience with them and they have a different and anyone that's done that crossover they've actually just excelled at their job yeah I I definitely agree with that and

I think you know kind of when I first started in the industry there were certain platforms that you kind of had to use and we were trying to move a lot quicker potentially than what the technology available was at the time so that was from ourselves wanting to understand real time data being able to make changes optimization quicker to even the Affiliates and the advertisers wanting to see their data as well so I guess instead of us continuing to get frustrated with what was available we

started to build out our own our own platform um and I do I do agree having the experience and knowledge of both sides definitely helps because you don't focus on maybe the aspects aren't as important as well um I know you know for the fact that we we work quite heavily with Affiliates and advertisers as well as the clients because without the Affiliates advertisers then the clients aren't going to drive Revenue they're not going to be paying for an affiliate Trucking platform so I think it's

really important to understand the needs of both sides both sides particularly and then going to the next question it's I had a newsletter that I published recently and I talked about how I think there should be a bigger importance placed on tools that can help operators improve their Revenue whether it's it's it's optimization uh stopping Revenue leak anything that gives them an edge and usually the tools that they start with are on the affiliate program side and so in Staton we've documented over a thousand I

gaming affiliate programs closed in three years we're now adding 50 per month we're closing 30 per month it's a constant 30 per month um so what would you say for the industry moving forward that do you think we're focused on too many sales like we've got a lot of white label operators it's so easy to launch the next I gaming operation um do you think uh there should be a focus on saying let's stop these brands from even going out of business and the ones that

are kind of in the middle ground can we make them be stronger my opinion is this benefits Affiliates yeah yeah no absolutely I think there's a bit there's a difference right between every brand you know a lot of white label Brands um I've worked with them before where make as a business you may create five white label Brands you may want a potential duration of each of those Brands so I think when it comes to the larger Brands and and you know I think the shift

has happened to retention already and I think that is mainly because of acquisition costs rocketing that has probably happened over the last five or six years so these smaller white label brands that maybe don't have the budget there to do that they have to focus on on retention because they're not able to compete with the larger Brands they're not able to bring in the better player value so being able to understand and focus on that retention side is is incredibly important um I don't think that

was the case really in the past as much I think you know a lot of the brands that we work with it was a lot about quantity over quality it was driving as much players into the business as possible and hoping that you were going to get a whale um of such um it's quite interesting that you said about you know 50 new programs opening but 30 and closing it'd be really interesting to kind of understand the dynamic of that and the size of those programs

and which ones are opening so you know other the smaller Brands and smaller programs closing but the larger ones are opening or of those 30 that are closing are you seeing as a pattern where it's every kind of 12 13 14 months and they're just kind of staying for that kind of smaller period um I guess with ourselves I mean we're not seeing a reduction in programs opening however you know to be honest we are still kind of towards the start of our journey so we

are kind of understanding the market still a lot and kind of what we're going after and I guess the main thing is is what are these Brands after for an affiliate program kind of go back to longevity but we have Brands where they will when they're speaking to us they will only want to agree deals for six months for nine months because they know that they're going to only be here for a certain period of time which is absolutely fine but I think there needs to

be some understanding and transparency on that especially when working with with Affiliates yeah I think you actually touched upon something interesting so while we do have that data of the 50 programs being launched the 30 being closed I actually do want to analyze and go what's behind this can we can we identify any patterns is it all white labels or how how many what looks like decent sized operations still find a way to fail um I I think the you know the the details and the

data and I think if we actually dig a bit deeper maybe maybe that actually might be an interesting feedback loop for affiliat to say look we're not just going to charge you the flat fee it's uh the flat fee is going to be even higher because you fit this quality or characteristic and um I think you're right it's because the costs have gone up that it's actually changing you know people the shift for retentions should be everything yeah yeah absolutely and I think there is you

know particularly with I mean they not they're not I guess they are still Emerging Markets but they are becoming you know kind of settled now but you look at Africa South America even North America I guess we have clients who will reach out to us who have been informed that they need an affiliate program they know that Revenue can be driven through and they know that it can be a profit for the business perhaps that knowledge and understanding isn't isn't fully there so I think something

that we need to do as a business and something that we kind of have a lot of care attention on is actually understanding the business whether they're brand new whether they've been going for 10 years 15 years and what they want from an affiliate program a lot of businesses and you know we're the same Revenue we want to bring in more clients we want to drive Revenue to our business however I would rather have a client that comes into the business and is with us for

four or five years so us giving them that feedback sharing that knowledge with them gives us a better understanding of what's going to be successful for them so that may be from providing a lowc cost solution for them for the first three to six months so they can they can test the water they can see if their brand is viable with viable with Affiliates and I think a large understanding is is how quickly they can expect Roi on what they're what they're paying out and that

is sometimes quite a shock to some clients that are brand new into the business they think if they spend spend spend $10,000 then month two they're going to return that on some fortunately that's not uh not the case might be for some people but yeah our our job and our kind of um something that we kind of really ensure that we do is is is give as as much facts as possible to that client before they before they sign up and I think you have experience

in PPC and SEO and I'm I'm wondering if this is part of the the new ecosystem to say well do you really want to have an A brand that is 95% dependent on Affiliates where that's all of their revenue because Affiliates basically have the power to say look uh you know your three biggest Affiliates can just pull the plug on you and then you're kind of suffering do you think that brands should be putting that as part of their marketing plan plan it's like look you

shouldn't be fully riing on Affiliates it's if you want to have a healthy longevity you should put money on PPC and understand how it works invest in SEO because I actually believe that the brands that do these things tend to have better player values and that's an extension of affiliate marketing where when they're being seen in SEO and being seen in PPC it has the feedback loop of going you know that next click from the affiliate click is probably going to convert higher and maybe maybe

have a better value no I think you you put the nail on the head there I think you need to do a number of different marketing Channels with PPC SEO it goes hand inand with affiliate marketing as well so the more content and the more um eyes that are on the brand is going to essentially help the Affiliates and it's going to help the Affiliates in regards of uh ratios registration rates click to registration all of that is extremely important to an affiliate and it way

you can start to maybe agree better deals with the affiliate because they're going to get a better CPA rate because they're going to bring more conversions through to them um I think when it comes to affiliate marketing I think why is so popular and why it's so interesting as a first fourth call is because it's it is a very easy way to start driving your brand and getting a reputation on the back of other people's traffic and volume and that is the great thing about affiliate

marketing is that you can have a lot of knowledge or you can have very limited knowledge but you can set up a brand you can set up an affiliate program and you can start to drive that through certain Affiliates advertisers who will help you through that I think the next step and what we've just kind of focus on the last question is then the longevity of that so understanding and getting a lot of players through and you have a lot of deposits you have a lot

of Revenue but then really understanding and figuring out where that value is and which Affiliates and advertisers are driving that that value is the next step to kind of being that larger brand a lot of people expect to be but yeah with PPC and SEO and and affiliate marketing the more channels that you can drive through the better because again it's all in regards to conversions Affiliates want conversions Affiliates are going to give you better deals if they can see conversions and they're going to be

a lot more um they're going to be a lot more friendly to your brand over others and you know how many brands are out in the in the industry and we also know the 10% of Affiliates that drive the majority of the truffy as well would you say that PPC is kind of like the last untapped Frontier of like you know where operators could actually get more value from the traffic I've talked to some operators where they're like yeah we're we're one of very few companies

tapping into certain markets in a certain space all on PPC and they're like they're just so glad that um their competitors are kind of too scared or don't have the budgets to kind of you know you can't afford to make a big mistake because if you burn your budget and you don't get that Roi I mean you actually have to be really good with your with your numbers yeah I agree with that I think it's very difficult to difficult to difficult to compete with PVC because

you're competing against a lot of other businesses that have large extremely large budgets and again with brands that wanting to try and perhaps get a quick return on on their investment you're not going to get that through PPC it's a long game there's a lot of mistakes as youve just mentioned and some of them mistakes can can really kind of hold what you're doing um so I think it's scared maybe but kind of bit nervous about going through the PPC route because again going back to

affiliate marketing it's a it's a much more risk free well riskless I say um Channel um and I think you do need to have probably more direct knowledge when you're looking into PPC and SEO as well for that yeah they're both kind of risky because I mean you get the wrong person on board your SEO could be damaged overnight and your PBC budgets could be blasted in in a week yeah yeah absolutely and and as I say I think the amount of budget that you could

spend on PPC in a day a lot of brands are spending that on a month in their affiliate their affiliate their affiliate program I believe that to be true I have a tough question and I'm not sure what the answer is I think Affiliates want this answer but they're not asking it which is is there a way where Affiliates could be part of helping with retention it's Affiliates are typically seen as like an acquisition Channel but there are some sites maybe forums are kind of more

more retention focused I'm just wondering what do you have for thoughts on how it feels could be part of that retention equation or how could they change their content and Market such that that's a part of their ecosystem I think absolutely you know I think it's it's really important that that Affiliates are part of that conversation and whether that's from the content or the marketing that they're doing or it's or it's actually speaking with the client themselves and discussing that data you know perhaps even giving

them some additional information about those customers and what they're doing and why they're playing so as an example you may have an affiliate that's driving sport players that they're going straight to casino if the affiliate doesn't understand that because they may only see one overall Revenue in the affiliate program they might not be aware that they're driving Casino players could they then start changing the content that they have on their website could they start changing the way that they speak to the customers on their site

I mean you look at the likes of odds cheer as a retention website their odds grid is is probably one of the largest retention you know tools in the industry for sports book how however it's very difficult to understand how understand how understand how many acquired customers from other Affiliates are utilizing odds Checker right until you remove yourself from the odds grid that's probably the only time you can start to understand that so obviously I imagine we'll talk about kind of bi to later on but

having that interaction with the affiliate and giving them perhaps that additional information it's going to serve both sides of the coin for giving that that understanding so the affiliate knows their their traffic and knows their volumes better than anybody else however the brand then also knows what that player journey is and how that player and customer will work throughout so I think there's there's a lot that the affiliate can do retention wise to help but that's that's got to start with the brand and they've got

to provide that information to that affiliate to help and would you say that usually that information you're talking specifically is kind of like a beast foke report that they have to go in and say look here's a beast fol report on what's Happening across our entire brand ecosystem and then here's you in relation to that yeah I think so I think you know when it comes to you know the reports that we display Raven tra they are they are unique and different to each brand because

it will depend on the data that we receive from them however not every affiliate or Advertiser is going to want to know what game the custom play on what sport they're betting on what time of day they're betting what you know what emails are are being more revent to them so I think instead of having all of that information thrown into a platform where you can then start to miss the important data within a platform you know I've used platforms where they throw everything in there

and then it can be really difficult to pick the the important elements of that so that's why you have the be tools that's why kind of internal dashboard that the brands have I think that's that's where that data should come from we can do with Raven we can do thepoke reports and we have done for for certain Affiliates that they want to see that information but I think you have to be really careful not to overshadow the kind of key facts and figures of of acquisition

right because it comes down to either the affiliate manager who's getting that report for you or the affiliate to say okay would data is important here like you can get all the data but sometimes it's either analysis paralysis or maybe the Insight requires someone who's a good analyst to actually dig a bit deeper yeah yeah absolutely and and that's the thing you know every every business is different some businesses have one affiliate manager some have 50 affiliate no affiliate managers at all it might be the

marketing director that's running everything so it all depends on what they're trying to achieve from each marketing channel and from my experience before Raven track when things are going well and revenues coming through and you're hitting a great you know your p&l is looking positive you you rarely look at the the intricacies of of each player but sometimes it's when it's a little bit too late and you start to pay a lot of money for maybe poor traffic maybe traffic sources have changed so I think

this again going back to the brand and what they can do I think it's it's important that important that they work with the Affiliates and not just think of them as a as a tool of driving players right I'm wondering if there's maybe a new role for not just an affiliate manager but someone who's more of the analyst as an affiliate manager that not only knows how to get these reports in maybe like your uh platform like Raven track but just even knowing like what reports

are useful because it's uh what I think to be the current state of our industry is that most of the fil managers coming into the space like we're going back to the 50 new programs it's it's sales so I have 2,000 affiliate accounts we create an account for every program whether like we're basically only sending them Affiliates like that's our only traffic and it's a one-track mind it's like what gs do you have and we try to explain what we do and it just goes over

their head I just think maybe there's like three different layers of affiliate managers there's ones that are focused on sales like to their detriment there's ones that are very good with with relationships but maybe they don't have the bi analyst experience experience experience I'm thinking there's actually a role available for an analyst yeah yeah absolutely I think you know going back to kind of businesses I've worked with you know we've had affiliate managers where they have no responsibility at all apart from customers coming through the

door if those players are poor or those customers are continuing to play that's a CRM team's fault they given the in they in their Ro that's all they do but they have work with B businesses where the affiliate manager it's their responsibility for the ROI so they need to have that I think data analyst I think for me if I was to to start a marketing business today and and and build a brand out then a data analy would be probably one of my first hires

alongside in the Philip manager because that that is where you remove a lot of the risk in in overspending and overpaying for for customers so if you know that a player value you know a player is probably going to leave that brand after 3 months or two months or six months whatever that is you know that you need to grab that value and you need you will know exactly what kind of CPA that you can agree to with an affiliate so if you know that a

player value lifetime value is $300 or 300 pounds then you know that you can't go over that in regards of the CPA and I think when you've got an affiliate manager that is just responsible for driving traffic and not responsible for the value that traffic I think there can be a real divide then on what happens within the business I mean I prefer the latter I think an AIC manager should should be responsible for the whole journey I think there has to be responsibility on the

crmt as well for extracting that extracting that value but I also think it can be difficult with the tools available for an affiliate manager as well right if they are only able to see what that affiliate is done every 24 hours how can you optimize things in in real time so I think a lot of the tools that we're working on within Raven track is to give as much opportunity to optimize as possible for that affiliate manager because we know that again there are very experienced

affiliate managers there are affiliate managers that are just joining the industry you know I was one when I started and I would have loved to have had some of the tools are available now kind of 12 years ago so I think yeah again every business is different and some businesses can't afford five affiliate managers five day trist so you need to be able to provide the tool to businesses that have one person or businesses that have 100 100 people I think what you said about having

like one affiliate manager and one analyst as your as your two first people where the first person is really the analyst I think that's insightful because you know I think uh there's a lot of people that it's it's depositing players first it's not the retention or the longevity um but I think there's kind of like a risk in going well you could either double your Affiliates or imagine you could actually double the value that's coming in from your Affiliates I mean one sounds easier than the

other but it's we're not seeing it with the exception of like you know the bigger programs that actually invest and have a bit yeah yeah absolutely I mean we um back in the day when I was at active win we created uh an anchored report which essentially would give you an understanding of players that signed up in February 2022 it would tell you what they have done in March 22 May so on and so forth so what you would be able to then see is the

longevity of those players so you would then be able to review February 22 players maybe 90% of them still playing however your February 23 players maybe only 10 % of them are playing so you then you'd be able to understand and review why is that the case has the affiliate perhaps changed traffic Source has the brand changed the welcome offers a lot of it then comes to regulations you know has there been a change in regulations the way the players can play and deposit you know

there was a big shift when credit cards were removed from from deposits but having that understanding and Analysis means that you're not combining everything together and still working with the older players and they're actually overshadowing the fact that you need to make changes and make differences for for kind of acquisition at the moment and customers I want to talk a bit more about CRM and bi tools because it's almost like when people think about crb they're thinking about like Salesforce and HubSpot and I I have

heard a lot of affiliate managers use these tools and I believe these tools are more sales focused and they're not maybe there's a way of using them better um I don't think they're always relationship focused like they're more focused on let's get the number of Affiliates can get signed up and that it's like the number of ftds or ndc's like those are the two metrics they care about but I think a good affiliate manager is the relationship building I think we're missing the relationship building component

of tech either native inside affiliate platforms or um I think there needs to be a change in CRM and then the other side of it is the bi part yeah yeah absolutely I think just kind of picking up your you mentioned there about relationships I think that is very much over overshadowed sometimes and a lot of people don't think about how important the relationship is with Affiliates and I think that's probably why you see a lot of people stay within the industry when they move to

different brands and operators and you will see a shift affiliat advertisers moving across with that affiliate manager because they have that relationship that relationship and with the relationship comes trust as well right so if you're a brand new operator and nobody's heard of you and then you maybe bring in somebody who has that relationship with Affiliates then you're working on you're jumping on the back of that reputation and relationship that that affiliate manager has so I think that's extremely important and you kind of mentioned there

about CRM tools maybe being very sales focused I think it depends on how you want to use the CRM tool again going back to businesses whether they have one person or 100 people I think you can use it in a lot of different ways um we're INR lot to move who who I personally think are a very good CRM tool you know they're experts in their field we're not experts in CRM so we work with third parties who are experts in their in their in their

field but what I have seen um mistakes in the past been where CRM is internal so it's inous within the business is that they they group all affiliate traffic together so they will assume that every player that comes from a raven Tru B tag or a income access B tag or my philli or or whatever it's going to follow the same journey and it's going to be the same customer pattern that's where a lot of the mistakes come from because they need to understand the affiliate

again and the affiliate needs to discuss with the brand what what their traffic is that affiliate that you're spending $700 with CPA they'll be working with 50 or 60 different brands so they know how to extract that customer value so whether that be an exclusive welcome offer that that player gets whether they get a an email on the second day of signing up or whether you give them a week or whether you wait for an exclusive event I think that's really important from a CRM team

to understand to understand that player from a from a um social media affiliate will be completely different to a PPC affiliate which will be completely different to a content-based affiliate and I think that's where CRM team will get their worth is by not coupling everything together um because they're completely different every affiliate you know has complete different way that they drive traffic and volume and they're interested they want retention as well whether it's CPA or not they still want that player to keep coming back because

it shows that they can drive value to your bus and they can keep the CPA at the levels that they want to I want to take a quick step back because you mentioned optim Mo now maybe I just don't understand them as much are they meant more for uh an operator to manage their players or is that also a tool to manage your Affiliates it's tool to manage sorry to manage their players right yeah so we work with them so essentially they have all the the

information and data in regards to that customer and where that customer goes to what games they play how long they stay on the site and what they do they couple that with the data that we have from an acquisition perspective so how much that customer we've had to pay for that customer to come in what Revenue share they're on so they couple that together and they will understand what value they need to extract from that player to essentially break even and make profit I think from

a CRM perspective for Affiliates so say Hobs you know going out and speaking to affiliat I would personally not utilize that I would I would rather have an affiliate manager that reaches out individually it you know the amount of events events conferences you know forums that You' mentioned earlier John you know there's a lot of opportunity to reach out to these affiliates and these Affiliates are very open to working with Brands and new brands you know new brands into the market are perfect for them because

they're not saturated and they're able to start driving more traffic but I think when you start seeing CRM systems if I was an affiliate I would probably put them to the bottom of the list over someone reaching out and kind of make it a bit more personal I would agree and then taking a step back to like the CRM component I'm just thinking out loud that let's pretend I I was back you know being an affiliate today I would actually want to know who's actually working

on these retention or uh tools to optimize the business or even ones that stop Revenue leaks so for example optimove is a is a good CRM um I know Greco does bonus abuse like if I'm sending players to an operator I want to make sure that the bonus abuse isn't going to like knock them out of business which has actually been happening for for like decades or like what what other kind of tools like maybe they can use um like Warrior lab for kind of going

hey what does our VIP program look like I'm just wondering if you think there maybe could be a feedback loop to say hey if you're going to be working with this brand it's not just that they use Raven track they also have these other platforms um just thinking out loud if you think this would be a valuable feedback loop no definitely I think anything a brand is doing to help extract value from a the affiliate should know about that because it's going to put you above

the brands within the industry and I think a lot of this is done by a lot of Brands but they don't give that visibility and I think you know some Affiliates that they don't care that's that's absolutely fine because they you know they know what they're driving and they they leave it up to the brands and they don't really want to know how they do it they just want to know that it's being done but I think your larger advertis and Affiliates you need to have

dialogue with them because a lot of the Philips advertisers have a lot more knowledge than the brand as well when it comes to how you can extract more value so they will know whether another brand is using the bonusing tool whether they're using traffic guard to stop forent traffic coming through whether they have a really good VIP program that they're seeing a lot of value from I think that dialogue is extremely important and there are only only a number of brands that do that extremely well

I'm I'm I'm we privileged to have quite a lot of them on raag and track um and you can see that it works because you can see the value and and the way that the Affiliates will drive more traffic to that brand because they're trusted and having that dialogue is it means that that that communication that trust is there and that relationship starts to build so yeah I'd agree I think that goes not just for these Services I think it goes for anything from what's coming

up in the next six months months months is there going to be brand changes is there going to be a new welcome of coming in are you going to be opening a sports book are you going to be working with new gaming providers all of this is is gold for Affiliates because well ahe you're giving me uh a lot of good points of what we could do as a company so I should probably be sending you a payment or commission for for all this help right

worries um one topic that I think is actually not talked about a ton of and you touched upon it which which is like a VIP program and it's interesting because I'm planning to have um you know gy from Warrior lab on as a guest at some point and he was saying that he felt he rocked the boat by talking about the fight club it's like don't talk about Fight Club don't talk about VIP but I think we're getting to the point where people want to know

more about this like um personally I think a lot of operators if they don't know about the different CRM tools like optimove it's or Recco it's kind of like well what about VIP it's like like you said with the the previous affiliate managers that have that experience like where do you find these people how do you build your program out yeah I think um I think VIP programs are um I think you're right with the fight for reference I think people don't really want to talk

about it and maybe that's down to kind of regulations and how you extract that value and what you deem as a VIP Customer because I suppose You' got to understand it's it's the that decides whether a customer has thep and how they deal with them um I think that conversation needs to be had and I think it needs to be a lot more open in regards to to how that is and again it comes down to you know you talk about CRM tools VI VIP tools

you know bonus of using tools Unfortunately they all come at a cost to the business as well so all these Services they need to extract the value from that customer for it to be you know for it to be possible for the company to continue with that so I think everything that's done has to be done strategically I would always suggest that you you work with the experts within each field so again mentioned optim you know we work with traffic guards from fraud prevention tool even

from um you know content creation we work with the lies of B Banner now and banner flow because that's that's what they do so just as we integrate with third parties who are experts in the field I think BR should do exactly the same thing as well if they've not got that resource that resource internally I agree and then last question is what do you think is the future of affiliate marketing as it intersects with business intelligence um I think you know we obviously touched on

it kind of earlier I I I think we're working very heavily at the moment with um internal bi tool with the brands themselves so currently and a lot of the time is that they send us the data we filter the data out we provide it to the Affiliates we run commissions we show everything in the way that it should show and then they pull it straight back into their internal dashboard with commission costs with everything that they need to see for a raven track now we're

working with a number of Brands to say well what can we extract from your in internal bi after we've passed the information back to you so whether that comes from you know what that customer does further on what products they play on what games that they play on so actually instead of the data coming in and then coming straight back out how can we extract some of the data from your internal bi system as well to show more formative information for the Affiliates within within our

platform platform platform itself um we have a lot of data that comes into the platform already um obviously it's up to the brand and the client what information that they want to display with Affiliates or not we that's entirely up to them what they want to do we went we spoke earlier about um in in the past a lot of platforms that have utilized have thrown too much data in and then it can be very difficult for you to extract and understand the important information about

that and I think that needs to be really carefully thought out on what you do in regards to that data however that doesn't mean to say that if an affiliate who has who is a large business some of these Affiliates are larger than the brands brands themselves give them the data that they want give them the data that they need to help to help to help optimize and and really push acquisition across um obviously you know generative AI a lot of people are speaking to that

at the moment we want to we're working with a number of companies at the moment to build that into Raven track because we know that a report that you might want JN is completely different to what Dar might want or might be completely different to what one client to another client want and we shouldn't restrict Affiliates or Brands to what they should see or affiliate managers we should say here's all the data you can do whatever you want with this data because a lot of Brands

a lot of affili they just use the API they will export put it into Excel and then they will run their own pivot tables because that's specific to their needs what we want to be able to do is mean that they can keep everything within Raven track so they can create a bespoke report for them so when they log in in the morning their dashboard will say these are your top 10 Affiliates by clicks or these are your top 10 Affiliates by Affiliates by Affiliates by

country we suggest that you go and speak to affiliate a because they've increased their conversion rates over the last week this is all the information that we want to showcase because essentially we have that data available to us and we want to be able to support people and users using our platform to be able to do that I think you're touching upon sort of a problem we have in that Affiliates will ask us going hey if we can use statr data and then build a custom

Tableau dashboard they're kind of like well you tell us what is possible but sometimes they have a very specific need they're like I need exact this they they come with everything prepared and I think it's really difficult to have a one siiz fits all like like you said absolutely I think sometimes they might not know what they want as well but I think that's down to to ourselves to be able to push them in the direction that we believe that they should go in um we

have a lot of clients that will move from their own proprietary software to to our platform and I think that is you know that is important that usually happens when the brand gets to a certain level where they need to Outsource that to somebody that focuses solely on that so I would always suggest and I would always recommend whether it's a brand with ourselves with ourselves or my Affiliates refer whoever speak to the platform ask them you know what's working well what what are some people

doing that's slightly different to us because we want the brands to grow we want them to stay with us we want them to keep building their revenue because it helps both sides of things so I think yeah you've got that help and support available and I know that you know we would definitely provide that information and support of what we think you could be doing differently um so I would really strongly suggest that people do reach out to their to their tracking platforms to to to

that and then there could be another conversation or an article about um what it's like to build your own stat tracking platform on our side and the same thing on your side which is um do you want to do this in-house or do you want to go with an established platform and I think we already know what our answers are in advance but I think uh there's some educational content we could be doing to say you're going to do it this is what you're going to

go up against and this is these are all the examples of how it can work but yeah you pick and choose what you want I think I think you're right there so you know you work with a lot of clients we work with a lot of clients so something that they may be doing at the moment with their propri software that might be taking them five days to run a report it might be taking them a long time to do something speak to us because we

we will have a feature or we will have a solution that may make things a lot easier that is that is that is our main goal as a business is to make people's jobs easier and to extract and drive as much revenue as possible to the business it really is as simple as that um you know we have the the experience and the knowledge of working with Brands Sports sport Casino Bingo Lottery Forex African Brands European Brands you know American brands we can help we can

push you in the right direction of what we think you should do and we we can always recommend certain aspects as well Adam uh thank you so much for doing this this is a really insightful chat I didn't even get to most of the questions because we went down rabbit holes and it was uh entertaining how can people get inv all of you and I'll pass it back to you yeah so um if you want to hear about Raven track and the best place to go

is is ravent tr.com you can reach out to me personally Adam ravent tr.com or you've got contact at ravent tr.com as well um if you want to have a demo of our platform you know we'll be able to send you across logins and yeah it'd be really interesting to to speak to people even you know if you've got no interest in moving across to us if you want to have any kind of information or knowledge I really enjoy having conversations about this awesome thank you so

much for doing this John thank you very much thank you for tuning in to the affiliate bi podcast I'd like to take this time to ask for a small favor to leave a rating and review wherever you listen to your podcast that helps us expand our reach to rank higher in podcast directories and reach more listeners